[Cascade]

keylime, on Jun 26 2007, 12:49 AM, said:

I wholeheartedly agree with Frances, with pass being a more standout action due to style (I rarely overcall 5 card minors unless decent hand).

And 20 points is not a decent hand for you?

[Echognome]

Cascade, on Jun 25 2007, 11:13 AM, said:

keylime, on Jun 26 2007, 12:49 AM, said:

I wholeheartedly agree with Frances, with pass being a more standout action due to style (I rarely overcall 5 card minors unless decent hand).

And 20 points is not a decent hand for you?

You better make a mental note to respect Dwayne's overcalls.

On a side note, I played against a pair once who had the agreement that 1-level overcalls showed an opening hand and 2-level overcalls showed 15+ (i.e. better than a minimum opening hand). I told them how great it worked on the 1 hand in 24 boards it came up. In the meantime, we had simple uncontested auctions and jammed the heck out of them on their constructive bidding.

[barmar]

These days people get away with all kinds of crappy overcalls, because it tends to be hard for the opponents to make penalty doubles. Think about all the times you've prayed for partner to make a reopening double so you could convert it to penalty, but instead of doubling he rebids a suit. The more artificial doubles you have in your system, the more opportunity the opponents have to bid on junk and not get punished for it.

But not only is it hard to punish them, but you also end up going wrong in the play. It's great to study books like "How to Read Your Opponent's Cards", but if they bid randomly you're going to make wrong inferences. Which, of course, is why they do it -- making things easy for declarer is not high on their priority list.

[Cascade]

Echognome, on Jun 26 2007, 07:28 AM, said:

Cascade, on Jun 25 2007, 11:13 AM, said:

keylime, on Jun 26 2007, 12:49 AM, said:

I wholeheartedly agree with Frances, with pass being a more standout action due to style (I rarely overcall 5 card minors unless decent hand).

And 20 points is not a decent hand for you?

You better make a mental note to respect Dwayne's overcalls.

This reminds of a hand against me where the bidding went 1♠ passed out making nine tricks.

At the end of the hand dummy said to declarer "did you have 25 hcp?"

Declarer picked his cards back out of the board looked at them and said "it appears I did"

Dummy replied "I'm going to sit up when you open 2♣"

[Fluffy]

I am afraid pass stops the bidding there, I would pass, someone's got to bid spades, if its parter we have found a game: 3NT.

[helene_t]

I might start with 2♣ but I'm not sure how to continue, nor am I confident that 2♣ passed out is a good spot. I'd consider overcalling 3N but that's probably crazzy. Dbl is ok in some styles, not in mine though.

barmar, on Jun 25 2007, 10:10 PM, said:

These days people get away with all kinds of crappy overcalls, because it tends to be hard for the opponents to make penalty doubles.  Think about all the times you've prayed for partner to make a reopening double so you could convert it to penalty, but instead of doubling he rebids a suit.  The more artificial doubles you have in your system, the more opportunity the opponents have to bid on junk and not get punished for it.

I beg to differ. If opps are poor competitive bidders, I'll interfere more readily. In particular, if they don't have a negative double at the two-level, it's more attractive to jam them. In fact I think that overcalls have become more sound in the last decades. This is partly because of lighter openings but also because of better competitive methods, in particular artificial doubles.

If partner reopens with a double whenever he would have passed a penalty double, you don't have this problem. If, on the other hand, p only reopens with a double if he has reasonable defense, you'll miss some penalty opportunities but on the other hand you'll be able to pass some reopening doubles with hands that couldn't double for penalty.

Quote

But not only is it hard to punish them, but you also end up going wrong in the play.  It's great to study books like "How to Read Your Opponent's Cards", but if they bid randomly you're going to make wrong inferences.  Which, of course, is why they do it -- making things easy for declarer is not high on their priority list.

True, but you should above all read your partner's cards. And if opps bid randomly in order to confuse me, I'll win in the long run because they confuse each other as well.

[Codo]

really no bid makes happy.

If it starts
(pass) pass (1 ♥) 2 ♣
(X) pass (2 ♦)

If it starts with
(pass) pass (1 ♥) 2 ♣
all pass

you may have a problem
And pd won´t bid with most 5 HCPs which may produce game.

So 2 ♣ won´t solve any problems. Nor does pass.
Do you really believe, that pd with lets say
Qxxxx,x, Jxxx,Qxx will reopen? (And this hand is quite strong, he could have less for game).

Of course X is as bad as it could be too, for the reasons others gave.

But I try double and 3 ♣ yes this may be wrong, but if we have a fit, it will take me to a game all of you will often miss- or to a silly contract which I cannot make, but at least I wil get punished for being overly optimistic, not for being a whimp.

[jtfanclub]

mike777, on Jun 25 2007, 12:06 PM, said:

jillybean2, on Jun 25 2007, 11:59 AM, said:

If 2♣ is clear and the auction was:

(pass) - pass - (1♥) - 2♣
(x)  ---  pass -- (2♦) - ?

Do you have another bid?

Pass is my second bid.

So if I overcall clubs the first time, and double the second time, I'm all alone?

Oh well. So be it. since all four suits have been shown, partner should feel comfortable with leaving in the X unless he has absolute crap.

[nige1]

Edmunte1, on Jun 25 2007, 07:34 AM, said:

Dealer: West Vul: N/S Scoring: IMP

♠   ♥ AQJ93 ♦ KQ8 ♣ AKJ102

(pass)-pass -(1♥)- ?

Teams, you're sitting South.

1) What's your bid?

2) If you double and bidding goes
(pass) - pass - (1♥) - dbl
(1♠) ---  pass -- (2♦) - ?

What is your choice now?

Agree with Frances - always safe -
[A] P = 10, 2 ♣ = 7, X = 1
[B] P = 10, 2 ♠ = 5, 3 ♣ = 4, 2 N = 2.