[geller]

imps, None Vul, East Dlr
You, South, hold
♠AJ53 ♥K ♦AKQ86 ♣K84

East passes. You open 2NT. West passes. North responds 3♣ (Puppet Stayman). East overcalls 3♥. You pass, LHO (West) passes, North doubles. East passes. What call do you make?

[655321]

Abstain.

I certainly did not open 2NT.

[geller]

655321, on Jun 1 2008, 10:44 PM, said:

Abstain.

I certainly did not open 2NT.

I didn't open 2NT either, nor did my partner or teammates. But this is a real problem from a real tourney, so given the start (which may not be to everyone's taste, including mine) I'd appreciate knowing what people would call now.

[jtfanclub]

If my pass of 3♥ showed 4 spades (I'm used to an X showing that, but whatever) then I've shown my hand and I pass.

If my pass of 3♥ didn't show anything, then I'd bid 3♠, and I'd have a long talk with partner about methods over interference after the hand.

[NickRW]

jtfanclub, on Jun 1 2008, 02:00 PM, said:

If my pass of 3♥ showed 4 spades (I'm used to an X showing that, but whatever) then I've shown my hand and I pass.

If my pass of 3♥ didn't show anything, then I'd bid 3♠, and I'd have a long talk with partner about methods over interference after the hand.

Agree

[mr1303]

If partner's double is take-out, then I take it out. However, I then ask the question why I did not make a take-out double of 3H.

If partner's double is penalty, I lead the sytematic top diamond.

And I also object to the 2NT opening.

[mikeh]

This question cannot be answered without explanation of one's agreements over interference.

It is possible that the pair did not have any agreement in place, in which case we are down to a guess. I do not think that there is any reason to guess to pull.

I echo the voices against 2N. Why distort an easily biddable hand?

[kenrexford]

2NT is dumb. We all agree.

The question was what to bid. Everyone so far has said to do what the systemic agreement calls for. People have supplied their agreements. The OP did not.

I'm curious as to what is the default here. Does anyone know? I think that is the question. Does Opener's doubloe show four spades, or is it penalty?

[Apollo81]

I'll bid 3♠, if he has a penalty double he'll just bid 3NT and we're fine, if not then we certainly don't want to defend.

I think trying to guess what partner has for the double is irrelevant, but FWIW when people bid over 2N they tend to have their bids so I would guess takeout despite our short hearts.

[ArtK78]

This is not exactly following the topic of this thread, and if you interpret this as a hi-jack, I apologize.

I have never discussed in any partnership methods for handling interference over our 2NT openings or interference after a 2NT opening and a first response. For years, that would have been academic - no one ever interfered over 2NT openings. But I am seeing interference now more and more often.

Does anyone have a set of agreements of what to do over interference over 2NT openings? Are your agreements different over natural overcalls as opposed to conventional overcalls?

By the way, double and lead trump is not the kind of response I am looking for, although it may be effective.

Thanks.

[kenrexford]

ArtK78, on Jun 2 2008, 03:19 PM, said:

This is not exactly following the topic of this thread, and if you interpret this as a hi-jack, I apologize.

I have never discussed in any partnership methods for handling interference over our 2NT openings or interference after a 2NT opening and a first response. For years, that would have been academic - no one ever interfered over 2NT openings. But I am seeing interference now more and more often.

Does anyone have a set of agreements of what to do over interference over 2NT openings? Are your agreements different over natural overcalls as opposed to conventional overcalls?

By the way, double and lead trump is not the kind of response I am looking for, although it may be effective.

Thanks.

I had a lengthy idea as to what to do in the event of a double of Puppet 3♣, to allow Opener to show or deny a club stopper while also addressing the major holdings. If you are interested, send me a message. I am afraid of hijacking the matter myself. LOL

[gnasher]

kenrexford, on Jun 2 2008, 09:38 PM, said:

I had a lengthy idea as to what to do in the event of a double of Puppet 3♣, to allow Opener to show or deny a club stopper while also addressing the major holdings. If you are interested, send me a message. I am afraid of hijacking the matter myself. LOL

I'm not afraid, and I have a very short idea of how to deal with it:

- Redouble suggests playing in 3♣
- Pass denies a club stop
- Anything else is a normal reply to 3♣ and promises a stop

After a pass, responder redoubles to ask opener to make his normal reply to 3♣.

[kenrexford]

gnasher, on Jun 3 2008, 04:48 PM, said:

kenrexford, on Jun 2 2008, 09:38 PM, said:

I had a lengthy idea as to what to do in the event of a double of Puppet 3♣, to allow Opener to show or deny a club stopper while also addressing the major holdings.  If you are interested, send me a message.  I am afraid of hijacking the matter myself.  LOL

I'm not afraid, and I have a very short idea of how to deal with it:

- Redouble suggests playing in 3♣
- Pass denies a club stop
- Anything else is a normal reply to 3♣ and promises a stop

After a pass, responder redoubles to ask opener to make his normal reply to 3♣.

Whereas that, on its face, seems good, there is a major problem, as I see it. When Opener lacks a stopper (passes), you want to provide more description than normal puppet sequences allow. This is because the lack of a club stop might direct you into Moysian territory. So, as you are often seeking 4-3 major fits as well, and maybe even 4-4 or 4-3 diamond fits, you need something a little more advanced.

[nige1]

geller, on Jun 1 2008, 08:30 AM, said:

Imps, None Vul, East Dlr You, South, hold ♠AJ53  ♥K  ♦AKQ86  ♣K84
(_P) 2N (_P) 3♣
(3♥) _P (_P) _X
(_P) ??

IMO

• Without a discussed, generic or implicit agreement, partner's _X is likely to be penalty -- because in a game-forcing auction, doubles are usually penalty -- similarly, if you had doubled 3♥, then that would logically have been penalty. If neither of you can double for penalty, an opponent with an escape suit who knows your methods might even try to pick off your 4-4 fit.
  
• If partner doubles in tempo in a new partnership, you might not want to bet the ranch on your interpretation and a discrete 3♠ may be the better part of valour.
  
• If partner doubles slowly then, ethically, you may feel constrained to pass.
  
• If partner doubles at the speed of light, you also face a hard decision