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ATB: disastrous partscore

Poll: ATB: disastrous partscore (46 member(s) have cast votes)

Assign the blame

  1. 100% North (6 votes [13.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.04%

  2. 75% North, 25% South (5 votes [10.87%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.87%

  3. 50-50 (4 votes [8.70%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.70%

  4. 75% South, 25% North (8 votes [17.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.39%

  5. 100% South (23 votes [50.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 50.00%

  6. Both made reasonable decisions, unlucky hand (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

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#21 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2011-September-21, 12:58

View Postgwnn, on 2011-September-21, 12:47, said:

3♣ didn't promise the world and South already denied a good hand. Having a wide variety of game forcing bids seems misguided.

So when did south deny a good hand? Over 1♥?
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#22 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2011-September-21, 13:10

yes...
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
      George Carlin
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#23 User is offline   nigel_k 

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Posted 2011-September-21, 14:28

View Postgwnn, on 2011-September-21, 12:47, said:

3♣ didn't promise the world and South already denied a good hand. Having a wide variety of game forcing bids seems misguided.

Obviously there are better uses for double and 1♠ but playing standard methods I think you should have decent values to bid 2♦ as you are taking the auction quite high with no fit and no stopper. And opener is going to have extras and good clubs to bid 3♣ opposite a passed partner so I think hands where responder wants to bid constructively will be much more common than those where he wants to improve the part score and also couldn't bid 3♦ the round before.
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#24 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2011-September-21, 15:10

View Postwhereagles, on 2011-September-21, 03:38, said:

hmm.. I don't think I understood that. What was the point again?

:P I should have added a good 5 bagger as well, sry your point is well taken. It all goes back to Al Roth's original notion that a negative double shows any hand that has some values and can survive whatever bidding trap ensues.
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#25 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2011-September-21, 15:18

View Postnigel_k, on 2011-September-21, 14:28, said:

Obviously there are better uses for double and 1♠ but playing standard methods I think you should have decent values to bid 2♦ as you are taking the auction quite high with no fit and no stopper. And opener is going to have extras and good clubs to bid 3♣ opposite a passed partner so I think hands where responder wants to bid constructively will be much more common than those where he wants to improve the part score and also couldn't bid 3♦ the round before.

Cool, in that case I think what you think is false (and vice versa). :)
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#26 User is offline   eternaluke 

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Posted 2011-September-22, 05:16

I like a negative double that shows values but not shape 1 1/2 Quick tricks is a great spot for a negative double. Sure it would be nice to have ideal shape every bid, but even here that HHh in spades is not at all bad. playing a 4-3 fit wouldn't be horrible. south needed to make the best of bad bids first round and pass didn't cut it there.
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