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Lead against 2NTx

#1 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 07:47


IMPs
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
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#2 User is offline   brian_m 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 08:53

View Postmgoetze, on 2012-May-05, 07:47, said:


IMPs


Was this a typo, and you didn't mean to post? Either that, or these forums have some major incompatibility with 64-bit chromium as a browser, and I'm only seeing a truncated posting.

No indication of what hand types are in your (presumed) multi 2♦.

No indication of what the alerted 2♥ meant. Did you ask?

No indication of whether you have any agreements about your partner's double of 2NT. What information, if any, do you have from the fact that South doubled 2NT but didn't double 2♥?

No indication of what's in your profile, or your partner's? Especially not about any lead agreements?

Were the other three players GIBs. and you expect us to know all this? Presumably not, since you're opening a multi.

What answer can you expect other than "insufficient data"? I am, of course, making the assumption that you opened 2♦? Maybe not...
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#3 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 09:03

I have a surprising amount of defensive strength given the auction, so a passive lead should be fine. I'd lead a spade, which partner has at least five of.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#4 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 09:06

View Postbrian_m, on 2012-May-05, 08:53, said:

Was this a typo, and you didn't mean to post?

No.

Quote

No indication of what hand types are in your (presumed) multi 2♦.

Do you seriously think it matters? Well OK, just for you: the hand types are (a) approximately 6 hearts, weak; (b) approximately 6 spades, weak; © 22-23 (semi)balanced.

Quote

No indication of what the alerted 2♥ meant. Did you ask?

There is plenty of indication as to what 2♥ meant.

Quote

No indication of whether you have any agreements about your partner's double of 2NT.

If I had solid agreements on this and still didn't know what to lead I would have posted in a different forum.

Quote

What information, if any, do you have from the fact that South doubled 2NT but didn't double 2♥?

Double of 2♥ would ostensibly have been pass or correct. This agreement is perhaps not ideal when 2♥ has this meaning.

Quote

No indication of what's in your profile, or your partner's? Especially not about any lead agreements?

LOL? If you want to know what's in my profile just log on to BBO and check? Surely this is massively irrelevant. If you think the correct lead is a low heart then say low heart, don't worry about whether that would mean the 3rd, 4th, 5th or 6th - we do have agreements about that.
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#5 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 09:13


mgoetze writes "IMPs"

Guessing ♠3 = 10, ♥Q = 9, ♣5 = 5, ♦6 = 4.
Hoping that partner has something like ♠ KQJxxx ♥ x ♦ Qxx ♣ Axx

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#6 User is offline   wyman 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 11:44

♠
"I think maybe so and so was caught cheating but maybe I don't have the names right". Sure, and I think maybe your mother .... Oh yeah, that was someone else maybe. -- kenberg

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#7 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 11:59

View Postbrian_m, on 2012-May-05, 08:53, said:

Was this a typo, and you didn't mean to post? Either that, or these forums have some major incompatibility with 64-bit chromium as a browser, and I'm only seeing a truncated posting.

No indication of what hand types are in your (presumed) multi 2♦.

No indication of what the alerted 2♥ meant. Did you ask?

No indication of whether you have any agreements about your partner's double of 2NT. What information, if any, do you have from the fact that South doubled 2NT but didn't double 2♥?

No indication of what's in your profile, or your partner's? Especially not about any lead agreements?

Were the other three players GIBs. and you expect us to know all this? Presumably not, since you're opening a multi.

What answer can you expect other than "insufficient data"? I am, of course, making the assumption that you opened 2♦? Maybe not...


1. Yes, the 2♦ opening could include a balanced 22, since that's what partner is basing his x on.

2. The alert of 2♥ is in the diagram.

3. If Mgoetze had an agreement about the double that it asked for 'x' lead, he wouldn't have posted it.

4. See #3.

5. LOL
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#8 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 11:59

I lead a spade. I also expect to annihilate 2N.
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#9 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 13:48

Spade 3. Lowest=attitude.
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#10 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 14:15

is there any indication that 2NT might had been intended as lebensohl?, some table feeling or such might change the things.

against a natural 2NT heart lead is very bad, spade or diamond looks best. Spade has 2 ways to win: because it might be passive and because it might be partner's suit and he is asking us to lead it. So I would go for that unless I suspect 2NT wasn't natural.
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#11 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 14:42

View PostFluffy, on 2012-May-05, 14:15, said:

is there any indication that 2NT might had been intended as lebensohl?

RHO had another chance after partner doubled 2NT. Wouldn't he have taken out to his suit?
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#12 User is offline   ggwhiz 

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Posted 2012-May-05, 15:24

I had a very similar auction once but to 3ntx by my pard and the opp led the Q♥.

We made 7 when their partner had 7 solid spades. That or 6 semi-solid with a sidfe Ace is the only possible explanation for partners double here.
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#13 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 12:13

View PostPhil, on 2012-May-05, 11:59, said:

I lead a spade. I also expect to annihilate 2N.

This post is half correct :)
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#14 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 12:17

View Postgwnn, on 2012-May-06, 12:13, said:

This post is half correct :)

Yeah my double sucked, LOL. But I did think it asked for a spade lead even undiscussed.
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#15 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 14:27

View Postmgoetze, on 2012-May-06, 12:17, said:

Yeah my double sucked, LOL. But I did think it asked for a spade lead even undiscussed.

People seem to be leading a spade based on logic and what they are looking at, but not saying it really asked for a spade lead. So, the double couldn't have sucked that bad if a spade lead works well.

Do we get to be result merchants, now, and see what the double looked like?
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#16 User is offline   mgoetze 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 14:42

View Postaguahombre, on 2012-May-06, 14:27, said:

Do we get to be result merchants, now, and see what the double looked like?

No way, that would be too embarrassing! ;)
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#17 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 14:57

View Postgnasher, on 2012-May-05, 14:42, said:

RHO had another chance after partner doubled 2NT. Wouldn't he have taken out to his suit?


He might not do it if he had UI or if he really trusted that partner had decided to pass the lebensohl conciunsly (imagine a 2344 6-7 count for example)
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#18 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 16:56

Do we get a chance to look at the hand, or just listen to the private joke?

JK :)
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#19 User is offline   CSGibson 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 17:03

X should be for a spade in my opinion.
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#20 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-May-06, 18:38

View Postmgoetze, on 2012-May-06, 14:42, said:

No way, that would be too embarrassing! ;)

Come on. Stick it out there. I keep doing it with my minority views, such as this:

Gives people something to take shots at, and sometimes makes them think.
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