[manudude03]

---

North deals, bid these however you like. Opps unsurprisingly silent.

[CSGibson]

1H-1S,
2D-3C*, 4th suit forcing
3S-4N,
5S-5N*, specific kings
6C*-6D*, King of clubs, asks to bid grand with the K of diamonds
6N*-7N. Denies K of diamonds, but does show extras in context, 7N says perfect, just what I was looking for.

[wank]

CSGibson, on 2014-January-08, 19:36, said:

1H-1S,
2D-3C*, 4th suit forcing
3S-4N,
5S-5N*, specific kings
6C*-6D*, King of clubs, asks to bid grand with the K of diamonds
6N*-7N. Denies K of diamonds, but does show extras in context, 7N says perfect, just what I was looking for.

what he said except 4s, not 3s. 3s just shows a doubleton spade and a hand unsuitable for doing anything more useful, such as 3NT. 4s is a 3 suiter, too strong to raise to 2s directly.

[CSGibson]

wank, on 2014-January-08, 21:26, said:

what he said except 4s, not 3s. 3s just shows a doubleton spade and a hand unsuitable for doing anything more useful, such as 3NT. 4s is a 3 suiter, too strong to raise to 2s directly.

Sure, unless you have specific agreements to the contrary - my preferred agreement is that preference shows Ax, Kx, or any 3, and that the default bid in this sequence with no clear preference be 3♦, to allow the most room to explore.

[nige1]

manudude03, on 2014-January-08, 19:11, said:

North deals, bid these however you like. Opps unsurprisingly silent.

---

CSGibson bids this well but I'm afraid we'd probably end up in 6N or the inferior ♠ grand.

[SteveMoe]

1♣(16+) - 1♠(8+; 5+cards)
1N(Beta) - 3♣ (7 Controls) !!
7N

[nige1]

SteveMoe, on 2014-January-09, 23:04, said:

1♣(16+) - 1♠(8+; 5+cards)
1N(Beta) - 3♣ (7 Controls) !!
7N

Canna thole interminable asking bid sequences

[JLOGIC]

Seems like an auction where north keycards will work much better in terms of getting to 7N rather than 7S, but seems like south will be the one keycarding on typical auctions which makes it tough.

[lycier]

manudude03, on 2014-January-08, 19:11, said:

---

North deals, bid these however you like. Opps unsurprisingly silent.

---

[FrancesHinden]

Getting to 7S is easy. Getting to 7NT is harder when you aren't looking at both hands and inventing an auction.
It's possibly easier at matchpoints.

Our auction would start 1H - 1NT (5+spades) - 2C (multiway) - 3C (nat FG) - 3S (15+ with 3 spades) probably followed by some keycarding and responder would know about the HA, SQ, DA, CK which (assuming spades run) is 12 tricks. Opener must have another card: the DQ, CJ or HQ all give you 13. The worst case is QJx AJ9xx KJx Kx but partner might have opened that 1NT (we don't automatically) and it's not clear which is the best grand anyway.

[manudude03]

The main problem on this hand is that you had to get to 7NT (or 7H by North). 7S goes down due to an unfortunate break.

---

[CSGibson]

FrancesHinden, on 2014-January-12, 04:04, said:

Getting to 7S is easy. Getting to 7NT is harder when you aren't looking at both hands and inventing an auction.
It's possibly easier at matchpoints.

By the way, my auction would be unlikely (but not impossible) at the table, quite likely in the post-mortem as a way to have gotten there.

[MrAce]

CSGibson, on 2014-January-08, 19:36, said:

1H-1S,
2D-3C*, 4th suit forcing
3S-4N,
5S-5N*, specific kings
6C*-6D*, King of clubs, asks to bid grand with the K of diamonds
6N*-7N. Denies K of diamonds, but does show extras in context, 7N says perfect, just what I was looking for.

Chris, i suggest considering 5 NT a little different, only when the trump is spades.

5 NT--6x =this king or other 2 kings,,,this allows you to use 6y bids by 5 NT bidder as asking for Q or 3rd round control in a specific suit. As i said you can use this to the optimized level only when the trump is spades.

Not sure if it is worth to fill your memory with it though. But it ain't that complicated.

[CSGibson]

MrAce, on 2014-January-16, 19:03, said:

Chris, i suggest considering 5 NT a little different, only when the trump is spades.

5 NT--6x =this king or other 2 kings,,,this allows you to use 6y bids by 5 NT bidder as asking for Q or 3rd round control in a specific suit. As i said you can use this to the optimized level only when the trump is spades.

Not sure if it is worth to fill your memory with it though. But it ain't that complicated.

I've thought about it. It certainly clarifies some situations, but in others - like the extreme 2-suiter - I may be missing 3 kings and really need to know about one specific one. I'm not saying its bad, but there are potential trade-offs which I may not be willing to deal with in these situations where the most important thing is to play the same thing as your partner/have good and solid agreements rather than the best theoretical agreements.

[Cyberyeti]

Doesn't

1♥-1♠
2♦-3♣
3♠-4♣
4♦-4♥(will be high card not shortage)
4N etc get you to 7N trivially

even if N bids 4♠, then S keycards, it continues:

4♠-4N
5♠-5N
6♣-6♦(I have K or Q♦, bid 7 with the other)
6♥(no, but I know you have K♥ and you know I know that, so I'm going to show the Q)-7N (well if the spades run we have 13, if they don't we still have chances)

[gszes]

1h

1s

2d

3c gf

3s

4n rkc spades

5s

5n asking specific K

6c

6h (K or Q of hearts looking for 7)*

7n

*assumes we were always going to play spades since we have never agreed on a heart fit

[Zelandakh]

Hands with critical singleton kings are always tricky single dummy. My system forces South to do the asking so it is lucky this pair of hands uses the available space nicely and there is enough bidding room to uncover everything.

1♥ = up to 17, 5+ hearts, unbal
... - 1♠ = INV+ relay
2NT = max, 5 hearts, 4 diamonds, GF
... - 3♣ = relay
3NT = 3541, 4 controls
... - 4♣ = relay
4♠ = ♥ control, ♦ control, no ♠ control
... - 4NT = relay
5♣ = no ♣A
... - 5♦ = relay
5♠ = 2+ of top 3 hearts, 1 of top 3 diamonds
... - 5NT = relay
6♠ = ♠Q, ♣K, ♥J, no ♦J
... - 7NT