[MickyB]

the hog, on 2014-July-11, 20:04, said:

for the first time in my memory I actually think Nigel's ratings are correct and not off on planet Zorg.

the hog, on 2014-July-12, 00:18, said:

I was being polite, Justin.

[the hog]

MickyB, on 2014-July-12, 00:50, said:

that is very polite for me. Anyway, I praised Nigel, what more do you want?

[PhilKing]

aguahombre, on 2014-July-10, 14:40, said:

So, those who voted for "other" must be the clever ones who would unilaterally violate the basic system in use.

There are truly two choices. I chose the invitational one. Anything I might upgrade is offset, IMO, by my least favorite distribution.

Maybe partner will be the clever one and bid a surprise 3m while accepting over my 2NT.

JXX Jx AKQXX AJX gets to slam after a game invite sequence; film at 11.

I voted other - Stayman followed by 2♥. The real issue is what to do if someone then bids 2♠. If it is pard, I will bid 3♣. If it is the oppo I will bid 3♠. I remember Gawrys bidding this way against me once with a 1435 and it worked on a one hand sample. Maybe it will still work with only 4 clubs. I think this should be a scramble with short spades, but obviously I am winging it.

[msjennifer]

the hog, on 2014-July-12, 00:27, said:

So you are playing a convention that looks vaguely like, but is vastly inferior to Keri?

No Sir/Madam,the Explorer Relay is vastly superior to the Keri as developed by Klinger.It covers and caters for all possible combinations for a part game hand ,game going hand ,slam ambition hand,and slam forcing hands wherein Responder can find out exact distribution of the openers hand.With Keri ,Klinger nor anyone can depict or find out much about the distribution and strength.Klinger would never be able bid many hands using Keri or Stayman .the Explorer beats all the commonly played conventions outright.The Explorer can be used by a beginner,or upto Experts and gives immense satisfaction.Keri is totally a very inferior convention by Klinger whose short and long suit tries are miserable to say the least.

[the hog]

duplicate post.

[the hog]

roflmao. Based on these ill informed comments, I can only surmise that you have not read the Keri notes, let alone ever played the structure. Pray tell also, why on earth do long and short trials have to do with a NT structure?

[wenwylie]

We must have 3 Spades available to show this hand 1444 and game force

[msjennifer]

the hog, on 2014-July-12, 00:27, said:

So you are playing a convention that looks vaguely like, but is vastly inferior to Keri?

Kindly read my edited comments.

[msjennifer]

the hog, on 2014-July-12, 05:39, said:

roflmao. Based on these ill informed comments, I can only surmise that you have not read the Keri notes, let alone ever played the structure. Pray tell also, why on earth do long and short trials have to do with a NT structure?

I have thoroughly read the Keri but you do not know the Explorer.Keri is a third rate development comparatively,pardon me. as regards short and long suit tries described by Klinger which he applies after a 1H/S opening and a single raise are horrible.

[PhantomSac]

PhilKing, on 2014-July-12, 03:03, said:

I voted other - Stayman followed by 2♥. The real issue is what to do if someone then bids 2♠. If it is pard, I will bid 3♣. If it is the oppo I will bid 3♠. I remember Gawrys bidding this way against me once with a 1435 and it worked on a one hand sample. Maybe it will still work with only 4 clubs. I think this should be a scramble with short spades, but obviously I am winging it.

I think 3415 is a more classical shape to bid that way on (since you gain the added upside of passing a 2S response).

[fromageGB]

msjennifer, on 2014-July-11, 23:05, said:

...1NT --2C is a relay promising at least 8 HCP and at least one 4 card major.Opener bids 2D with 15 or BAD 16 even if he holds one 4 card major.Opener bids 2H holding both majors but 15 or BAD 16. opener bids 2 S holding both majors and 17 or Good 16.

It seems playable, where Keri, to me, does not. OK, critics, what's the downside?
Where do we find details of the other bids?

[blackshoe]

msjennifer, on 2014-July-12, 09:59, said:

as regards short and long suit tries described by Klinger which he applies after a 1H/S opening and a single raise are horrible.

I'll bite. What's your favorite game try structure on that auction?

[the hog]

fromageGB, on 2014-July-12, 15:26, said:

It seems playable, where Keri, to me, does not. OK, critics, what's the downside?
Where do we find details of the other bids?

Clearly someone else who has never played it. Perhaps you should change your nic to fromage chevre. I have played it for more than 2 years. It is emminently playable and superior to Stayman.

Already one poor feature of the other convention mentined is that you need values and a 4 card M to respond 2c. This makes it useless ver a wnt and far inferior over a snt, and that is even without seeing the rest of the structure. Anyway, the poster got a number of things wrong - namely that you cannot show exact shape with Keri. If someone gets such a fundemental fact wrong, it is obvious they nothing about it and are probably just promoting some home grown rubbish. No?

[awm]

2nt for me; I would be worried about the spade suit... if partner had bid 2♠ to stayman I would have bid 3nt though.

Usually I play methods where I can show these sorts of hands (the sequences are different in different partnerships) but I've been surprised by how many established pairs have no bids for them. It's pretty high-value, allowing us to reach better games and the occasional light slam.

I will say that I'm not a huge fan of Keri, after playing it for many years. My observations were that the 4-3 major fits on declined invites never seemed to work as well as Klinger advertised them in his book, and that the loss of garbage and crawling stayman seems significant (ability to sign off in 2♦ seems lower value). This "Explorer" method doesn't excite me on first pass either, because I very much believe that relaying out opener's shape is a poor approach, but I'd have to read the notes to know for sure.

[ladydoc]

My partner and I use a 3 spade response to indicate a 1444 hand that is gameforcing over a strong 15-17NT opening . It hasn't come up very often.