[mgoetze]

Thistle Tea could be good if rogues got something like MtG's scry effect, but as is it's way too random, and yeah could stand to cost 1 less anyway. I suspect they will be unveiling one or two pretty strong weapons for rogue this evening, at a level where everyone would have screamed "wow this + BF so OP" if they had been revealed earlier.

My midrange shaman is not losing much, so that might be my go-to deck on the ladder for a while when I'm not experimenting with new stuff. Plenty of options to replace my Piloted Shredders including Draenei Totemcarver, Rumbling Elemental, Fireguard Destroyer and Dark Iron Dwarf. I also have one Annoy-o-Tron and one Recombobulator which I'll just replace with random 2-drops like Flamejuggler or Boneguard Lieutenant.

But I'll be sure to ladder up some with my cancer paladin with Leper Gnome, Knife Juggler, Arcane Golem and, yes, Divine Favor before the release.

[Fluffy]

 mgoetze, on 2016-April-21, 05:48, said:

Leper Gnome, sure it was pretty much an auto-include in aggro decks, that doesn't mean you have to nerf it, it wasn't horribly broken or anything. Unlike, say, Alexstraza.

I used to think that if you were to make single card decks, leper Gnome was by far the best deck, which probably means it was OP.

I hate seeing nerfs with no replacements, and I am surprised dr boom is not nerfed yet.

[Cyberyeti]

 mgoetze, on 2016-April-21, 07:36, said:

But I'll be sure to ladder up some with my cancer paladin with Leper Gnome, Knife Juggler, Arcane Golem and, yes, Divine Favor before the release.

I thought this deck was known as eboladin, I use it occasionally.

[Zelandakh]

 Fluffy, on 2016-April-21, 09:22, said:

I used to think that if you were to make single card decks, leper Gnome was by far the best deck, which probably means it was OP.

Frost Nova or the like would make for a fun single-card deck.

[mgoetze]

 Fluffy, on 2016-April-21, 09:22, said:

I used to think that if you were to make single card decks, leper Gnome was by far the best deck, which probably means it was OP.

30 Leper Gnomes only has 50% winrate against 30 Mind Blasts, whereas you can get 100% winrate against the Mind Blasts with 30 Abusive Sergeants. But the Leper Gnomes win against the Abusive Sergeants so I think it's pretty balanced overall.

[mgoetze]

 mgoetze, on 2016-April-21, 10:02, said:

30 Leper Gnomes only has 50% winrate against 30 Mind Blasts, whereas you can get 100% winrate against the Mind Blasts with 30 Abusive Sergeants. But the Leper Gnomes win against the Abusive Sergeants so I think it's pretty balanced overall.

Twilight Whelp really needs a nerf though.

[Cyberyeti]

 Zelandakh, on 2016-April-21, 09:38, said:

Frost Nova or the like would make for a fun single-card deck.

30 frost novas v 30 ice blocks, possibly the least exciting game ever

[mgoetze]

 Cyberyeti, on 2016-April-21, 10:19, said:

30 frost novas v 30 ice blocks, possibly the least exciting game ever

Ice Block only triggers on your opponent's turn, so doesn't help against fatigue damage.

[WesleyC]

 mgoetze, on 2016-April-21, 05:48, said:

Still, you don't have to nerf an epic class card to the point where it is just straight-up worse than a neutral rare card. Draw 1 instead of 2 is fine for Ancient of Lore, now just reduce the mana cost to 6 and you have a properly balanced card. Leave it at 7 and you turn an epic card into total trash.

Leper Gnome, sure it was pretty much an auto-include in aggro decks, that doesn't mean you have to nerf it, it wasn't horribly broken or anything. Unlike, say, Alexstraza.

My preference is that the flexible druid cards (Ancient of Lore/Keeper of the Grove) *should* be slightly weaker than a non-flexible neutral option. Admittedly 7 is on the expensive side for Ancient of Lore, but at 6 it would be too strong.

I don't share your opinion about Leper Gnome either. If a neutral card is an auto-include in *every* deck of a particular style, then that feels like the perfect reason to change it. I'd much rather have a more diverse and slightly slower meta.

[Cyberyeti]

 mgoetze, on 2016-April-21, 13:35, said:

Ice Block only triggers on your opponent's turn, so doesn't help against fatigue damage.

I know, but it's fatigue v fatigue every game

Mirrored 30 thoughtsteals is worse

[Antrax]

Freeze mage for sure, I thought people will play CW to counter that and something like Midrange Hunter as the third side of the triangle.

[mgoetze]

So, rogue is pretty much dead, right? Didn't get any new weapons at all, Blade Flurry nerfed to oblivion, Oil is out and the only card they got to support any sort of combo style is the new legendary.

Warrior even got the better pirate cards...

[Antrax]

Depends who you ask: https://www.reddit.c...rafting/d2d8c5w

[WesleyC]

 Antrax, on 2016-April-23, 03:04, said:

Depends who you ask: https://www.reddit.c...rafting/d2d8c5w

Although i'm pretty sure Yogg Saren - a 10 mana card with an incredibly random effect - isn't going to be playable, I'm more positive about the future of rogue in standard.

The main thing in Rogue's favour is that it lost almost no playable cards in Nax/GvG (Tinker's Oil, Goblin Autobarber?) and getting rid of Dr Boom is a huge plus.

Xaril, Shadowcaster and Shadow Strike all look solid and are likely to spawn a new rogue archetype.

[Antrax]

Have you played around with the Yogg wossname simulator that was posted on /r/Hearthstone? I think it's also mentioned in the comments to the thread I linked to. It looks like an okay-ish "come back in the game" tool.

[WesleyC]

 Antrax, on 2016-April-23, 12:14, said:

Have you played around with the Yogg wossname simulator that was posted on /r/Hearthstone? I think it's also mentioned in the comments to the thread I linked to. It looks like an okay-ish "come back in the game" tool.

Yogg Simulator

I hadn't seen that link before, thanks! It's definitely a very cool card and all the non-targeted positive effects that you get are pretty strong.

I'm still unconvinced it will turn out to be playable though - 10 mana is just too expensive. I played quite a bit of mill rogue, and although it was fun, even with heal-bot and blade-flurry I couldn't consistently survive long enough for it to be viable.

[Antrax]

Mill Rogue will never be viable, Blizzard don't want the mill mechanic to ever be competitive.

I'm half-convinced they also printed Elise to give fatigue decks a less boring win condition.

[WesleyC]

My first impressions regarding WOTOG standard (about 30 games in) is that they've made a mistake with the balancing for C'Thun druid.

Twin Emperor is almost always two 4/6 Taunts for 7 and the Klaxxi Amber-Weaver comes out as 4/10 consistently.

It seems really strong against everything.

[mgoetze]

Yeah and with Mire Keeper the ramp is getting pretty consistent.

Naturally, Mire Keeper is one of the 4 rares I didn't get a single copy of in my 63 packs.

[Cyberyeti]

 WesleyC, on 2016-April-27, 10:47, said:

My first impressions regarding WOTOG standard (about 30 games in) is that they've made a mistake with the balancing for C'Thun druid.

Twin Emperor is almost always two 4/6 Taunts for 7 and the Klaxxi Amber-Weaver comes out as 4/10 consistently.

It seems really strong against everything.

Well except when RNG takes the piss, 7 cards left in my deck when I lost, 6 of them being the 6 pump up C'Thun cards.