[jerdonald]

BBO forum,
My partner and I open a strong 2 clubs with 21+ points or 4 losers or
8 1/2 quick tricks. On the convention card I can enter the 21 points
but all the other space in the DESCRIBE and RESPONSES/REBIDS blocks is
used for explaining responses.

Do I need to put 4 losers or 8 1/2 quick tricks somewhere on the card?

Jerry D

[nige1]

jerdonald, on 2016-May-25, 15:56, said:

BBO forum, My partner and I open a strong 2 clubs with 21+ points or 4 losers or 8 1/2 quick tricks. On the convention card I can enter the 21 points but all the other space in the DESCRIBE and RESPONSES/REBIDS blocks is used for explaining responses. Do I need to put 4 losers or 8 1/2 quick tricks somewhere on the card?

IMO yes but it might depend on local practice and regulation. Yesterday, I'm ashamed to confess that both my partner and I arrived with no system-cards. Luckily for us, generous and friendly opponents made do with a hastily scribbled outline, alerts, and explanations.

[wank]

nige1, on 2016-May-25, 16:12, said:

IMO yes but it might depend on local practice and regulation. Yesterday, I'm ashamed to confess that both my partner and I arrived with no system-cards. Luckily for us, generous and friendly opponents made do with a hastily scribbled outline, alerts, and explanations.

i would be ashamed to take a convention card to a club

[Phil]

Hi Jerdonald:

1. You probably don't mean 8.5 quick tricks, especially if you are opening 4 loser hands. This term generally applies to Aces and Ace-King or AQ combinations. You probably just mean "8.5 tricks".

2. The HCP requirement on the cc can be used as you see fit but with your style I'd say "22+ if balanced or 8.5 tricks"

[pigpenz]

Phil, on 2016-May-25, 16:43, said:

Hi Jerdonald:

1. You probably don't mean 8.5 quick tricks, especially if you are opening 4 loser hands. This term generally applies to Aces and Ace-King or AQ combinations. You probably just mean "8.5 tricks".

2. The HCP requirement on the cc can be used as you see fit but with your style I'd say "22+ if balanced or 8.5 tricks"

sounds good to me
I put 22+ or 9 tricks

[wanoff]

wank, on 2016-May-25, 16:18, said:

i would be ashamed to take a convention card to a club

Fair point, it's a bit like wearing a tie to the Eurovision song contest.

[msjennifer]

One has to mention 21/23+ HCP,(depending on your style),5+ quick tricks (Aces ,Kings and Queens Culbertson style),8+ Winners etc.on the convention card,wherever carrying a convention card is mandatory.This way one fully protects oneself from any further queries by opponents or for that matter the TD.Safety first.

[Vampyr]

wanoff, on 2016-May-25, 17:19, said:

Fair point, it's a bit like wearing a tie to the Eurovision song contest.

Wow, I wish I were cool enough to come without a convention card. Why should my opponents be able to see what I am playing? I'm special, and will start copying the cool kids by flouting the rules.

[wank]

Vampyr, on 2016-May-26, 05:56, said:

Wow, I wish I were cool enough to come without a convention card. Why should my opponents be able to see what I am playing? I'm special, and will start copying the cool kids by flouting the rules.

you're missing the point. at most countries' national tournaments, much though it's a waste of time, i bring a convention card, because sadly, it is a rule. in fact this is why i haven't bothered attending most of easter, new year or brighton for the last 3 or 4 years.

clubs make their own rules, and i wouldn't frequent any club which required them, and fortunately most have the good sense not to.

[Vampyr]

wank, on 2016-May-26, 06:09, said:

you're missing the point. at most countries' national tournaments, much though it's a waste of time, i bring a convention card, because sadly, it is a rule. in fact this is why i haven't bothered attending most of easter, new year or brighton for the last 3 or 4 years.

clubs make their own rules, and i wouldn't frequent any club which required them, and fortunately most have the good sense not to.

Why do you hate convention cards! What have they ever done to you?

[Phil]

Vampyr, on 2016-May-26, 06:58, said:

Why do you hate convention cards! What have they ever done to you?

They are great for writing phone numbers and email addresses.

[Caitlynne]

Honestly, I don't think your opponents would be misled or suffer damage if you don't put more, but it is clear you practice ethics that are beyond reproach. Given that, allow me to answer:

If your requirement is any and all 21+ HCP hands
OR any 4 (or fewer) loser hand
OR any 8.5+ playing (not quick) trick hand

then yes, you should include that information since those criteria in combination are not "standard." The issue is the HCP guideline inasmuch as there are 21+ HCP hands that have more than 4 losers and/or 8 or fewer playing tricks that would not qualify for 2C by many/most. For example:

AKJxx, KQ, AJxx, QJ

This hand features 21 HCP but it also features 6 losers and 7 playing tricks. I would never open this 2C - it is a super good 1S opener in my style - but if you open this 2C because of the 21 HCP it should be noted if you want to comply with the letter of the law.

Now, I do think that most people think that most 8.5+ playing trick hands (or 9+ playing tricks when the long suit is a minor suit) or 4 or fewer loser hands are suitable for a 2C opening good enough to force to 2NT, 3 of a major, or 4 of a minor. In my experience, very few good players would really put a HCP requirement on this 2C bid - though in practice it is difficult to imagine a hand with fewer than 19 HCP that would qualify since it is usually wise to open freakish two suited hands with a 1-bid (because the 2C opening robs you of bidding space, making it difficult to bid freaky two suited hands well and when you are weaker than 19 HCP with freaky distribtion, the chances of being passed out at the 1 level truly are miniscule). So, if this is your style, I think all you really need to put on your Convention Card is that your 2C opening is a strong, artificial, and forcing opening.

[elwood913]

wank, on 2016-May-26, 06:09, said:

you're missing the point. at most countries' national tournaments, much though it's a waste of time, i bring a convention card, because sadly, it is a rule. in fact this is why i haven't bothered attending most of easter, new year or brighton for the last 3 or 4 years.

clubs make their own rules, and i wouldn't frequent any club which required them, and fortunately most have the good sense not to.

I haven't posted in a while, but this made me perk up a bit.
Get over yourself you fool.
If you actually mean that you don't attend events because you can't be bothered to bring a convention card, you're a complete tool. If you just want us to think you're that cool, well, you're a complete tool.

[wank]

elwood913, on 2016-May-27, 03:53, said:

I haven't posted in a while, but this made me perk up a bit.
Get over yourself you fool.
If you actually mean that you don't attend events because you can't be bothered to bring a convention card, you're a complete tool. If you just want us to think you're that cool, well, you're a complete tool.

lol thanks. it's more than not being bothered to bring one (i.e. complete one as providence didn't endow me with an inexhaustible pile from which to bring one). it's the attitude they engender among my fellow competitors, who use them as an outlet for all their officiousness. it's typical for them to demand one as soon as they see you nearing the table and then file it under a bidding box without bothering to look at it. they also tend to look at my hand writing when i hand over my card, as if i've just handed them a dog turd, even though my hand writing whilst being aesthetically unappealing is far easier to read than most as i don't connect letters. it's also quite common for opps to accidentally walk off with them at the end of the round, but if you try to explain that to the next set of opps, they're more likely to try and get the director to force you to play the local equivalent of SAYC.

[The_Badger]

I tend to agree with wank. I remember many, many years ago playing at Brighton where two Life Masters had completed their convention card with "We play Acol, and a few unusual things that we will alert you to." (LOL!)

The problem with bridge these days is its like the EU - too many rules and regulations. Every little nuance in the bidding has to be categorised, clarified and spelled out which, fair enough, at national and international level is probably needed. However, at club level, I feel the enjoyment of the game shouldn't be compromised with petty arguments about the transparency of convention cards.

And getting back to Jerry D's question, whether he needs to clarify further what a 2♣ bid means, I would say that all players get what a 2♣ opening bid is, and no further clarification is needed. Only if you are using a different system such as Precision or Fantunes where 2♣ means something completely different should some explanation be given.

[mycroft]

Wow, that sounds exactly like how people react when I ask for their convention card over here (in an environment where "they have to be available, but no-one does"). Luckily there's no way people will walk off with it, for exactly the same reason. My mid-chart defences or Pre-Alert cards, however...

They want to complain about my handwriting? (well, I have used computer-genned CCs forever, because I *know* my handwriting sucks. But, you know, passive-aggressive) I have a neater handwriting - mostly because I have to slow down because I don't have N decades experience with it. If you want me to use it, fine. I should warn you, however, you probably have to be German and at least 85 years old to be able to read it...it's very neat, though.