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How many bids will this take? a hand from the club today

#1 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2026-February-09, 16:35

1st seat

"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
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#2 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2026-February-09, 16:42

View Postjillybean, on 2026-February-09, 16:35, said:

1st seat



Have they stopped moaning about the Dealer machine yet? :rolleyes:
And is it MP?

This is one of the few chances in a lifetime to trot out a 4NT specific Ace Ask with all Aces.
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#3 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2026-February-09, 17:12

Matchpoints, I dare anyone to grumble about computer dealt hands
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
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#4 User is offline   Gerardo 

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Posted 2026-February-09, 23:54

Set up as trump.
Ask KCs.
Bid 6 or 7 NT according to response.

A round King would also do, with an entry in trumps,
but no way to find about that, is it?

#5 User is offline   TMorris 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 05:49

I can imagine opening 6nt on the basis that I have never done it and will most likely never get the chance again.
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#6 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 06:48

 Gerardo, on 2026-February-09, 23:54, said:

Set up as trump.
Ask KCs.


A strong 2 clubs opening is likely to catch 4 (at least) from opponents. Not easy to keycard in spades after that.


 Gerardo, on 2026-February-09, 23:54, said:



A round King would also do, with an entry in trumps,
but no way to find about that, is it?

Not sure what trumps is about.
Unless I'm missing something you need to find partner with either T or a lower one that can be promoted to exploit a round King, if that's what you are saying.

My specific Ace ask will find any King, but I think I would only risk 7NT if it finds K.
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#7 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 09:15



2 (PASS) 2positive with spades. (PASS). edited
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
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#8 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 09:34

 jillybean, on 2026-February-10, 09:15, said:



2:2 positive with spades


Has your partner seen you pull this stunt before? :)

Are the opponents at least vulnerable?

Say it goes

2 2 X 3
?

Or
2 2 P 4
?

Or even
2 5 P P
?
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#9 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 09:45

I've misled you,
Not surprisingly, the opponents aren't bidding.

When I wrote 1X:1Y. its an uncontested auction. 1X 1Y X P is a contested auction, isn't this standard? :)
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
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#10 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 09:57

 jillybean, on 2026-February-10, 09:45, said:

I've misled you,
Not surprisingly, the opponents aren't bidding.

When I wrote 1X:1Y. its an uncontested auction. 1X 1Y X P is a contested auction, isn't this standard? :)

Thanks and rereading, I was misled.

But the stunt I refer to is artificially bidding a 2 card suit, a zealous Director might take issue unless it is alerted as "may be a fictitious suit" or similar.

I wouldn't be surprised if the opponents were bidding, there are three long suits and almost half the honours still out there. It pays to be aggressive with shape over strong openings.
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#11 User is offline   Gerardo 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 11:39

View Postpescetom, on 2026-February-10, 06:48, said:

A strong 2 clubs opening is likely to catch 4 (at least) from opponents. Not easy to keycard in spades after that.



Not sure what trumps is about.
Unless I'm missing something you need to find partner with either T or a lower one that can be promoted to exploit a round King, if that's what you are saying.

My specific Ace ask will find any King, but I think I would only risk 7NT if it finds K.


then, similarly as you do, I'd bid 6NT over 4.

#12 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 11:39

View Postjillybean, on 2026-February-10, 09:15, said:



2 (PASS) 2positive with spades. (PASS). edited


5N GSF
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#13 User is offline   Gerardo 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 11:40

View Postjillybean, on 2026-February-10, 09:15, said:



2 (PASS) 2positive with spades. (PASS). edited


Define "positive". Does it promise the K?

#14 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 11:59

View PostGerardo, on 2026-February-10, 11:40, said:

Define "positive". Does it promise the K?


What are you bidding with QJxxxxx, KQJ, void, KQJ, we're certainly bidding 2
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#15 User is offline   pescetom 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 12:09

View PostGerardo, on 2026-February-10, 11:39, said:

then, similarly as you do, I'd bid 6NT over 4.

I would bid 6NT now too: but I wouldn't be in this situation after our 4NT opening unless LHO has a monster that can find 5 or higher (over 5 Pass=no Ace, X=A, other as without interference; over 5 Pass=No Ace or A, X=A, other as without interference. Specific Kings ask is still on if partner showed an Ace or I failed to ask).
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#16 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 15:18

In NA it’s close to standard that a 2S ‘positive’ response to 2C deliversc5+ spades headed by 2/3 of the top honours. If we’re playing that, then it’s an easy 7N.

If not, then it’s an easy keycard, since the spade King is all we need. Yes, we may miss 7N when he has an unlikely diamond entry and a round suit king, but sometimes the game is too tough,

Btw, if looking for a swing, there’s a lot to be said for opening 7N unless the OPPs are both competent defenders. Most club players are not and will get confused when having to reduce to 1 card. Plus the contract may be cold anyway.
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#17 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2026-February-10, 15:25

View PostGerardo, on 2026-February-10, 11:40, said:

Define "positive". Does it promise the K?


First time playing, partner is very experienced so I assume what Mike said above. 2 of top 3, made for an easy 7N

7Nx3
7D
6N
6D x3
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly. MikeH
"100% certain that many excellent players would disagree. This is far more about style/judgment than right vs. wrong." Fred
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#18 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2026-February-11, 21:53

Giving the opps a chance to find a 7 level sac just seems too risky. I will open 6n UNLESS I have a 4N+ level method for locating the spade K. Bidding what I can make.
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#19 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted Yesterday, 05:16

View Postgszes, on 2026-February-11, 21:53, said:

Giving the opps a chance to find a 7 level sac just seems too risky. I will open 6n UNLESS I have a 4N+ level method for locating the spade K. Bidding what I can make.


You appear to be NV, opps are trying to hit a pretty narrow sac target particularly if they are vul
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#20 User is online   mycroft 

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Posted Yesterday, 10:41

Yeah, I'm with pescetom - 1 and hope it doesn't go AP :-). Great chance to go -500 with +2140 on...

I like the idea of 4NT specific A ask, but if partner has a round king, I am not sure what call I can make that says "find me another King, please".

2-p-2-p does make it easy... Maybe 2 and then as many spades as I have to bid avoids 1-AP -N?
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