[1eyedjack]

cardsharp, on Sep 2 2010, 09:35 PM, said:

inquiry, on Aug 14 2010, 07:31 PM, said:

<snip>

Or you can use a great little free tool provided by a commercial website. The website is www.bridgecaotain.com. If you want, you can download their free double dummy solver from one of their download pages (short cut to it is...

http://www.bridgecap...downloadDD.html  ).

<snip>

I blogged about some of the new features in this free program recently.

Can you clarify the "free" comment?

http://www.bridgecap....com/order.html

(I have no objection to paying for software, although my personal opinion is that this price is a bit steep.)

[1eyedjack]

1eyedjack, on Sep 5 2010, 11:55 AM, said:

cardsharp, on Sep 2 2010, 09:35 PM, said:

inquiry, on Aug 14 2010, 07:31 PM, said:

<snip>

Or you can use a great little free tool provided by a commercial website. The website is www.bridgecaotain.com. If you want, you can download their free double dummy solver from one of their download pages (short cut to it is...

http://www.bridgecap...downloadDD.html  ).

<snip>

I blogged about some of the new features in this free program recently.

Can you clarify the "free" comment?

http://www.bridgecap....com/order.html

(I have no objection to paying for software, although my personal opinion is that this price is a bit steep.)

Belay that. The order form is for Bridge Captain - a different product from the same supplier. The web site is confusing. Nothing on the DDDownload page suggests that it is free, and there is a link to "order" which takes you to Bridge Captain order page. Gives the impression that you have to pay for the DD solver.

[1eyedjack]

That double dummy solver looks interesting having tried it out. Shame that it does not adopt the GIB convention of telling you the DD result that would arise on each of the possible choices of the next card to be played. Sure you can go through each legit card and play it and then check what the DD result is, then undo that card and try the next etc etc, but clearly not as useful in that regard.

[Aberlour10]

I use exclusively the WIN version with the same "entry screen" as 8 years ago (traditionalist!),
No doubt, the web client has a lot of advantages, but the WIN has all the functions that I need and use, so I stay with it as long as it will be possible.

[mgiurgeu]

I have quickly glanced through this thread and was very sad to see Fred's posting where he confirms that there will be no significant developments to the Windows client. I think that is very unfortunate. I am using it exclusively mostly because I consider it superior in functionality but also because I don't like web based programs in general.

One feature (or lack thereof) that drives me crazy with the Flash client is that you cannot have South at the bottom during the play. When you go to review the board you just played you have look at the rotated diagram. It's so awkward!!!

Anyway, I still hold a glimmer of hope that Fred will have a change of heart and not abandon the Windows client.

Mircea

[1eyedjack]

@mgiurgeu
This is not news but has been announced by Fred many months ago.

Anyway, there are no immediate plans to "abandon" the Windows client - simply no plans to improve on it. So if it does OK for you as it stands, you have no need to worry.

I suspect that if and when the Windows client ceases to function, by then the browser version will have improved to such an extent that the differences in functionality would make you want to change at that point anyway.

[Siegmund]

Quote

I suspect that if and when the Windows client ceases to function, by then the browser version will have improved to such an extent that the differences in functionality would make you want to change at that point anyway.

Having to download a client before every time I want to play will never be an acceptable substitute for downloading it once and being able to launch it instantly in the future. Never. There may come a time when we have to do it, if there are no competing sites to move to, but we won't be happy about it.

I don't much care whether it's a standalone program or a plugin or a Firefox extension (though esthetically I prefer a standalone program - that way you know that third-party upgrades to the browser or the flash engine or whatever won't break it)... but having a way to make it live on my machine is very important to me.

Now, that's sort of the opposite of what web-based clients do - they emphasize being able to play from any computer, if you're patient enough - but I think there are a LOT more people who play consistently from the same few computers than who need to be able to log on from anywhere. The web client is a nice extra offering (it helps the people who e.g. cant install software on their work computers) but in my universe it would have remained the secondary product forever.

[cherdanno]

Siegmund, on Sep 11 2010, 01:33 PM, said:

Quote

I suspect that if and when the Windows client ceases to function, by then the browser version will have improved to such an extent that the differences in functionality would make you want to change at that point anyway.

Having to download a client before every time I want to play will never be an acceptable substitute for downloading it once and being able to launch it instantly in the future. Never. There may come a time when we have to do it, if there are no competing sites to move to, but we won't be happy about it.

You do know that there is such a thing as browser cache?
In practice, my browser only downloads the flash client whenever there is a new version.

[onoway]

The last time I went to the web client it seemed a little less cluttered and thus slightly easier to get to where I wanted to go. However, I still prefer the Win version..I don't see any improvement in the Flash chat area which to me is still highly unsatisfactory. The idea of having two chat windows (both of them miniscule) adds to clutter and doesn't make it easier to keep chat going where it is meant to go; the other day I was constantly getting messages clearly not meant for me from someone with whom I had exchanged greetings earlier.

The flash version tends to make me dizzy..I'm not sure why, but playing on it I feel disoriented. I only lasted 4 hands the other day before I had to log off the webversion and back in on the download version with a sigh of relief. I understand that it's possible to change the cards but that's a pain to try to figure out what/how to do, esp if it isn't clear if that would help. So much easier to retreat to the version which already works.

I don't like not knowing who else is kibbing at the table with me. I don't like not being able to just GO to a club without being challenged as to what I want to do there, so simply waiting in the club for a teaching session to start for example appears to be impossible. I don't see the point of having yellows when they don't SHOW as yellows on your friend's list. Other things have already been mentioned.

The web client is definitely getting much better and does have some features which are enticing, but although I will try it from time to time from curiosity I still can't see ever leaving my beloved downloaded version.

[1eyedjack]

Siegmund, on Sep 11 2010, 07:33 PM, said:

Quote

I suspect that if and when the Windows client ceases to function, by then the browser version will have improved to such an extent that the differences in functionality would make you want to change at that point anyway.

Having to download a client before every time I want to play will never be an acceptable substitute for downloading it once and being able to launch it instantly in the future.

I prefer the Windows client for reasons already stated, but this certainly was not one of them.

I am no techie but I can tell from personal experience that the speed of getting a session going in Windows, especially when there are 10K plus users online, is slower than in Flash, possibly as it seems to me that it downloads each logged-on user's profile at the outset.

Speed of initialisng the program sounds to me like a pretty trivial objection anyway, but I guess each to his own.

[spwdo]

several of my partners play flash. they have problems seeing loaded cc`s or dont see em at all.

When chatting i find myself sending mess. to the wrong ppl a lot in flash, the last person you send something too stays as next receiver while in windows version you send to the table you`re playing at. that makes more sense to me as your table is your main chat, when someone logs in you say hi and that's it. more chat needed i use control+r. Yes, its what im use too but i like it and do not find this minor chance a good one.

Loading profiles in flash, arggggg slow, before i read /see it the player i try to look at has a new partner already. having to click it away=bad change imo. Hover over a name-profile show, move mouse=profile gone, now thats perfect for us lazy folks.

i can live with partners using flash, altho not seeing same cc is regrettable . But if ever we only have flash as option to play i wont be a happy camper and might not log in anymore.

i tried flash numerous times , just for the mere fact that Staff advocates the flash version very strong. Days in a row but its not for me, sorry. i wish i was on the flash side just for the fact i understand that staff wont be doing anything on the windows version just to push ppl towards the new thing. Maybe in time when enuuf of the points i and others mentioned are addressed i just might but they will have to be changed while the windows version stays active .

I see that many ppl use windows version(pole) but i wonder why thew correct answer isnt there" i only use windows period" instead of mainly

[1eyedjack]

spwdo, on Sep 12 2010, 09:52 AM, said:

When chatting i find myself sending mess. to the wrong ppl a lot in flash, the last person you send something too stays as next receiver while in windows version you send to the table you`re playing at. that makes more sense to me as your table is your main chat, when someone logs in you say hi and that's it. more chat needed i use control+r. Yes, its what im use too but i like it and do not find this minor chance a good one.

I should have added this to one of my hates of Flash, so doing it now. So, ditto.

spwdo, on Sep 12 2010, 09:52 AM, said:

Loading profiles in flash, arggggg slow, before i read /see it the player i try to look at has a new partner already. having to click it away=bad change imo. Hover over a name-profile show, move mouse=profile gone, now thats perfect for us lazy folks.

Try clicking on Options/More Options/Advanced Options/Show Profile upon Mouseover.

It is not my preference, but it may be yours

I suppose that you have to choose between loading all profiles at logon (Windows) contrasted with at access of profile (Flash), but I am only guessing there.

[Jangvik]

I voted for the windows version. This is based on that it is the only way i can use BBO during work. I cannot log in using the flash version, always get the error connection lost. Probably due to restrictions in my company firewall. Taking about 2 minutes to log in into the windows version as well.

[rramjet]

i like the web version however since upgrading to opensuse 11.3 i can't maintain the programme as i keep getting a serious wine error and the programme shuts down
so looks like i will be forced back to the web version
i started with the web version but once i found the windows version worked with wine i liked it better
the reason is i play mostly in the relaxed club with pick up partners and the web version allows you to see the profile of your prospective partner as your cursor hovers over the name
i can't do this in the web version having to click on the name then refresh for the next one
much easier to find a partner using the web version
anyway that's my 2 bob's worth
keep up the good work it is a great site

[rramjet]

rramjet, on 2010-November-23, 06:00, said:

i like the web version however since upgrading to opensuse 11.3 i can't maintain the programme as i keep getting a serious wine error and the programme shuts down
so looks like i will be forced back to the web version
i started with the web version but once i found the windows version worked with wine i liked it better
the reason is i play mostly in the relaxed club with pick up partners and the web version allows you to see the profile of your prospective partner as your cursor hovers over the name
i can't do this in the web version having to click on the name then refresh for the next one
much easier to find a partner using the web version
anyway that's my 2 bob's worth
keep up the good work it is a great site

forget all that i just read all the posts and now have the mouse over so no reason not to like the web version
happy days

[kenberg]

Thanks for asking about this. I mostly use the downloaded version. It's easy. Mostly I just play. Mostly it's at home, so I just do it. Now here are a couple of things I have encountered on the web version.

1. (Small matter) I click on a name in the list of players. Some information comes up. I have half-finished reading it and it disappears. Perhaps there is a way of controlling this vanishing speed. Usually I am told I should have known how. I don't.

2. (Out of your control maybe) I have three computers, an XP, a Vista, a Windows 7. The most convenient one is the 7. One of your message boxes advocated using the web version (I do read your message boxes, fairly often anyway). Fine, I'll try it. No luck, something about Flash player. Well, I have Flash player. But it needed updating or something. Updating Flash player, there was a messagbe that my computer is 64 bit and it couldn't do it, and maybe this had something to do with Firefox. Or not. I wrote to the support folks. They made some suggestions. Didn't work. I explored around a bit. It seems Flash updating can be a pain. I finally got it updated. Now I can get on. No such problems on the XP, but the 7 is near the coffee pot.

Anyway, the download version just works, no trouble, I like it. I have confidence that I could learn to handle the web version (I usually manage such things when I put my mind to it, eg the problem with Flash) but there already is this nice version that does not require me to go through the frustration of catching on to the new approach. So I stick with it.

Demographic data may be relevant. I'm 71. I don't intend to let the world pass me by, but I have yet to make my first tweet. I use VPN but not Skype. I still drive a stick shift (I think I had to pay extra for it!). There is much to learn just to keep up, and if, as here, the download version works fine then I can put my time and energy into something else. Skype is on my list.

You got yourself one hell of a product there Fred, thanks, and you will probably eventually get me into the web version. But it is not as easy a transition as you might think. I'll try to come up with some more specifics.

[Gerardo]

Ken:

1) Keep the mouse on the just popped up profile OR click on Pin. If you move the mouse out an unpinned profile. it vanishes.

2) 64 bit Flash is fairly recent.

It your Win 7 is 64 bit, it will have 2 IEs, one for 64 bit, one for 32 bit. Flash versions must match IE.

So, you used to need the 32 bit version of IE to run BBO (because Flash was only available in 32 bit).

Nowadays, this should not be an issue.

[rramjet]

rramjet, on 2010-November-23, 06:05, said:

forget all that i just read all the posts and now have the mouse over so no reason not to like the web version
happy days

except now that i am using it the manual refresh is a pain
i look at a potential partner's profile and the info box comes up over the top of the refresh button
i navigate out of the profile box and wait for it to disappear so i can refresh the player list
it is a very slow process which the download version handles really well by instantly closing the profile box and refreshing the player list automatically.. very nice and i miss this in the web version
otherwise i am going ok on the web version

[1eyedjack]

It might be useful to post a followup poll addressed purely at those who habitually use the Windows version, what minimum changes or additional features they require to the web version in order to convert them. The poll would allow multiple selections. I have some ideas for the poll choices:

1) Instant automatic refresh of (eg) kibitzers and open seats at tables (separate poll options)
2) GIB double dummy solver available to kibitzers
3) Ability to autosave hands/sessions and/or chat locally (restrictions within Flash probably prohibit this, so if you tick this box you will never switch from Windows)
4) I will never switch from Windows until forced to do so by reason of its being discontinued.
5) Improved navigation (ie separate "Back" button from "Up" button).
6) Other

I haven't posted the poll, as I am likely to have missed some popular options.

[spwdo]

i wanted to register for the new bingo thing, one has to try everything and i was forced to go trough the webversion. When i returned to my loved windows version and the tourney started i got a message that one of my teammembers was not ready at gametime. Not ready meaning not on the forced client. I hope it helps getting people to turnover to the web version altho i regret the ways that re used to "help" people, it feels pushy(personal feeling). More effort on the web client, there are enuff "things to do" one can find in this topic.