[rduran1216]

---

just meat and potatoes 2/1, what do you open?

[mike777]

2c non expert but easy

1) lots of controls
2) lots of hcp
3) roughly 3.5 loser hand
4) long major, decent suit
-----


If I open 1s ihave no good rebid.
-------


2c wtp?

[Hanoi5]

1♠. I hope to get more info that way, hopefully that info won't be Pass.

[Mbodell]

With a good partner I open 1♠.

[jillybean]

1♠ wtp

[MrAce]

2NT

Of course 1♠ is standart. But lets try to predict the problems; He said 2/1

1♠--2x response, no problem.

1♠-1NT response and we are lack of rebid, at least a suitable one. I know most will say how they have gazilli or special agreements to show it, but as usual i will try to answer this as if this hand is mine and i am playing with one of the forum posters with a simple agreement of 2/1 0314 capp std card...

1♠--1NT
2♣/2♦/2♥ would be out of question for me.
2NT also due the range it shows.
3♣/3♦/3♥ perhaps for some people except than me
3♠, no way
3NT most logical among all others, but has the danger of wrong siding the contract and/or some confusion if pd bids something like 4♠. Did he have 3card ♠ and a weaker hand than 2♠ ? Did he have 10-12 3 card raise ?

Other alternatives are opening 2♣ or 2 NT, both also has flaws.

I would have to choose between opening 2NT and opening 1♠ then 3NT. Personally i would choose 2NT. At least if our final destination is 3NT we play it from where it is supposed to be played, 2NT also shows my precise strength compared to other options. The flaw is not the 6th ♠ for me, finding pd with some ♠s only makes me happy in 3 NT. The flaw is we may miss a slam in ♠, but with the agreements i have with pd, which is almost nothing, i doubt i would be able to bid that slam confidently anyway, had i opened 1♠.

[whereagles]

It's funny how this sort of near-2♣ 1-suiters come up over and over, isn't it?

Guess what? That's why some systems have specific bids for these hands. In 2/1 you either open 2♣ or mess up the auction with wierd 3-card rebids.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

whereagles, on 2011-July-27, 01:59, said:

It's funny how this sort of near-2♣ 1-suiters come up over and over, isn't it?

In 2/1 you either open 2♣ or mess up the auction with wierd 3-card rebids.

So true.

But I'm afraid I'll open 1♠ and make a "weird" GF 3♣! jump-shift ( may be artificial ) over 1NTF!

I believe Mikeh ( from last week ) has a system for this ( using the 3C! rebid ) desribed many years ago in BW called : Jeff's Magic Elixir .
Edit: http://www.bridgebas...1s-1n%3B-2h-3h/

This post has been edited by TWO4BRIDGE: 2011-July-27, 08:31

[Flem72]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-July-27, 08:27, said:

called : Jeff's Magic Elixir .
Edit: http://www.bridgebas...1s-1n%3B-2h-3h/

To the same effect, see also Eisenberg 3C and/or Meckstroth Adjunct.

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Flem72, on 2011-July-27, 08:51, said:

To the same effect, see also Eisenberg 3C and/or Meckstroth Adjunct.

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

Thx, Scott.... especially for the Meck Adjunct ! !

( BTW, has rec.games.bridge died or dying ? ) .

[Flem72]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-July-27, 10:39, said:

( BTW, has rec.games.bridge died or dying ? ) .

Lately, some flame wars. But usually good stuff.

SN

[rduran1216]

Ok again, you're not playing any fancy 3c jump shift relays or anything like that.

If you begin with 1S auction proceeds

1S 1NT
?

What do you bid now?

[nigel_k]

Open 1♠ and rebid 3NT if partner responds 1NT. We could miss a game sometimes if it goes all pass, but it's more likely we get too high if I open 2♣.

[semeai]

I bid 3♣ if my partner is aware I might fake a jump-shift suit (especially this one). This allows me to get to hearts when it's right and to attempt some intelligent decision between notrump and spades otherwise. I imagine these artificial 3♣ agreements discussed above grew out of the tendency to fake jump-shift suits, especially the lowest one, just like 4th suit forcing as an actual agreement grew out of all sorts of people faking a natural 4th suit.

If partner will take me too seriously, probably I should just rebid 3NT.

[Zelandakh]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-July-27, 08:27, said:

But I'm afraid I'll open 1♠ and make a "weird" GF 3♣! jump-shift ( may be artificial ) over 1NTF!

I am really surprised you do not play transfers over 1NT, Don. Then the GOSH is easily described by: 1S - 1NT; 2H - 2S; 3NT/4S. This approach would seem to be right up your alley.
Of course there are plenty of alternative gadgets for this auction. The title of this and most of the other threads of the type could be "Acol 2 hands are a problem without methods". For me the answer is simple - if they bother you that much then play Benji 2s, multi, or incorporate some gadgets for strong hands, if not accept it and trust most of the rest of the field has the same problem.

[Phil]

Flem72, on 2011-July-27, 15:17, said:

But usually good stuff.

LOL

[Phil]

1♠ is a non-problem, sorry.

Easy 3N rebid over 1N.

If I play the 3♣ gadget, I haven't had enough discussion with my partners about the nuances of 1♠ - 1N - 3N and 1♠ - 1N - 3♣* - 3♦** - 3♠, much less 1♠ - 1N - 4x.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Zelandakh, on 2011-July-28, 06:25, said:

I am really surprised you do not play transfers over 1NT, Don. Then the GOSH is easily described by: 1S - 1NT; 2H - 2S; 3NT/4S. This approach would seem to be right up your alley.
Of course there are plenty of alternative gadgets for this auction.

Thx, Zel.... I'll investigate the transfers.

But now I'm actually more excited about the Meckstroth Adjunct ( mentioned only yesterday by Scott in post # 10 ).

I found this link on it:
http://webcache.goog...=www.google.com

[rduran1216]

here are the two hands

---

Our auction went:

1S 1NT
3C 4C
4S 4NT
5C 6C
all pass

[Zelandakh]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-July-28, 10:27, said:

Thx, Zel.... I'll investigate the transfers.

But now I'm actually more excited about the Meckstroth Adjunct ( mentioned only yesterday by Scott in post # 10 ).

I found this link on it:
http://webcache.goog...=www.google.com

Well you could play transfers and the MA...
For example:-
1S - 1NT
========
2C = diamonds, or natural 2NT bid
2D = hearts
2H = 1-suited
2S = 4+ clubs, min
2N = art GF
3C = 4+ clubs, INV
3DH = 5+ clubs, shortage, GF
3S = 5+ clubs, 6+ spades, GF

Transferring and making a GF 3rd bid would show 5-5, going via 2NT only 5-4. Since you have gained so much extra space by using transfers I am sure you can further work out how to subcategorise 6-4, etc but I have not worked through enough detail on this yet myself. The disadvantage is not being able to stop in 2C if Responder is broke with (4)5 clubs. Nonetheless, I think there's plenty for you to work with here!