[Fluffy]

when the auction starts with something like:

1♣-1♥


it is much more common to have a 2NT rebid than a 2♦ rebid, yet the 2♦ rebid consumes a ton less space. Has anyone tried reversing these 2 bids to gain space on the normal hands?

[kfay]

Actually yeah I have done this.

We didn't exactly 'reverse' the structures. Rather, 2♦ was either diamonds or a big balanced hand. Responder could rebid 2M(non-forcing opposite 18-19bal, could be passed by the real reverse) or bid 2oM to ask opener to clarify. I think we played responder's rebid of 2NT or 3♣ were GF transfers and opener would do something special.

We then used 1m-1M; 2N to show the 'death hand' of a good 6-card minor with 3-card support.

Long story short was that it worked well but I hated it. It's been about 4 months since I used it and I already had to really think even to remember that much. I suggest you just open 2♦ with 18-19 balanced

[paulg]

Fredin-Fallenius reverse 2♦ and 2NT in the auction 1♣-1NT. Their notes (PDF) may be worth a look if you are looking for ideas.

They play transfer responses to a 1♣ opener and rebid 1NT over a major-showing response to show the strong balanced hand, so your specific auction is less of a concern for them.

[Free]

There are some Italians that play(ed) artificial reverses. If I remember correctly, Vincent Dumuy and Gavin Wolpert also played this.

In this case, after 1♣-1♥ they play:
2♦ = 16+HCP, <3♥ (lowest reverse)
2♠ = 16+HCP, 3+♥ (highest reverse)
2NT = something else, I think 13-16 with long ♣
Light reverses that immediately show the degree of fit in responder's suit. An interesting concept for sure. After these reverses, 2NT by responder is forcing (so opener can describe his hand), while most other bids seem to be weaker. Sort of like reversed Lebensohl.

[glen]

Free, on 2011-November-05, 00:43, said:

There are some Italians that play(ed) artificial reverses ...

Lauria-Versace 07:

1♣ Opening Bid:
1♣ --- 1♥ --- 2♦ = 16 up 5+♣ & 4♦ 0-2♥, or 16 up 6+♣ 0-2♥;
1♣ --- 1♥ --- 2♠ = 16 up 4+♣ & 3+♥;
1♣ --- 1♥ --- 2NT = 16 to 18 hcp one-suited ♣;

It would seem 4-5♣s, 4♠s and 0-2♥s rebids 1♠ even if very strong for the opening bid

[Zelandakh]

I have been thinking about this switch and I think it is even better in a strong club context than natural. In my system a 1C opening shows 15+ natural/balanced, or 18+ any. A 1S response is game-forcing without a 4 card major, over which I currently play 2D and 2NT as natural with 15-17, since 1NT would be a relay with the 18+ hand types. Switching 2D and 2NT here seems to work amazingly well, with 5 clubs and 4 diamonds opposite 7+ minor cards you are guaranteed a minor suit fit so you are not giving up too much by bidding this hand with 2NT, while the much more common balanced 15-17 hand gets so much extra space that it is difficult to find enough hand types for Responder to show. I can see only plusses here and can only thank you for introducing me to the idea.

[gwnn]

kfay, on 2011-November-04, 13:56, said:

Actually yeah I have done this.

We didn't exactly 'reverse' the structures. Rather, 2♦ was either diamonds or a big balanced hand. Responder could rebid 2M(non-forcing opposite 18-19bal, could be passed by the real reverse) or bid 2oM to ask opener to clarify. I think we played responder's rebid of 2NT or 3♣ were GF transfers and opener would do something special.

We then used 1m-1M; 2N to show the 'death hand' of a good 6-card minor with 3-card support.

Long story short was that it worked well but I hated it. It's been about 4 months since I used it and I already had to really think even to remember that much. I suggest you just open 2♦ with 18-19 balanced

Hey this is pretty cool and simple. I think you are a troll for hating it.

[Flameous]

Seems kfays method was something like simplified Gazzilli. (Yes, this is also referred to as Gazzilli though I know not many play "this" Gazzilli)

You might want to check Ambra notes, it uses 2D as nat reverse, 17+ clubs or 18-19 bal with 4H or 17+ 4H5+C and shortness.

[benlessard]

IMO an important principle for bidding system is that the cheapest forcing bid should always show different type of hands so that it end up with a fairly high frequency.

To use 2D as 16+ with 5C+4D is the perfect anti-example.

[Gerben42]

Hola Gonzalo, I am glad you asked

In fact I play that 2♦ shows either 18-19 NT or a natural reverse, 2NT directly showing a 1-suited hand in ♣ (either invite without 3-card support, or GF). 3♣ directly is 6-3 invitational.