BBF religious matrix
#41
Posted 2012-December-20, 15:31
Nor is this limited to any particular religion, or to religion generally. It certainly sounds like mikeh, for starters, thinks this way about his own beliefs.
For myself, I definitely do not think that the world would be better off if everyone thinks what I think. I have my opinions but I certainly don't think I have a monopoly on truth. Who is to say which philosophy will bring the most good to society, or which ideas will lead to advances in culture and civilization? So I voted supportive. The world would be much more boring if I could not approach Christians, Buddhists, Jews, Hindus, or Atheists alike for their thoughts and insights.
Hmm, I wonder, should Atheist be capitalized?
-gwnn
#42
Posted 2012-December-20, 15:39
mikeh, on 2012-December-20, 15:25, said:
As I see it, we are discussing intolerant parents teaching their intolerance to their children who then verbally bully another child, and you think we should let this go unchallenged?
If my child was actually bothered by it, I would certainly do something, the what would depend on far more details then are presented here.
In the far more likely case that my child is not bothered by it I would hope my child would tolerate the other kids beliefs.
I have to question the sincerity of your own beliefs if you think being told you will burn in hell actually rises to the level of verbal violence. I didn't think you believed in hell.
Also, I tire of the word intolerance. I was merely using the phraseology of the person to whom I was replying. This isn't the best word to describe what we are talking about, it is a loaded term meant to cast the opposing viewpoint in a negative light. Lets use the phrase sincerely devout.
#43
Posted 2012-December-20, 16:45
dwar0123, on 2012-December-20, 14:44, said:
You keep putting words in my mouth. You claim that I am intolerant to religious people or that I would teach my children to be intolerant to religious people, but that is simply not true. I have religious friends that I like. With some of them I sometimes talk about religion, with some of them I don't. When I do talk with people about religion, I won't say to them that I think that they are stupid (because I don't) or that they are bad people (because I don't).
I will tell them that I think religious institutions are bad, and the people willing to talk about religion with me tend to agree to some extend. Whether they believe that this world has a higher purpose or was created by some higher being really doesn't bother me.
- hrothgar
#44
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:05
#45
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:20
han, on 2012-December-20, 16:45, said:
I will tell them that I think religious institutions are bad, and the people willing to talk about religion with me tend to agree to some extend. Whether they believe that this world has a higher purpose or was created by some higher being really doesn't bother me.
It wasn't my intent to say any such thing and if it came off that way I apologize. I am a little puzzled by what led you to think I took anything other then this statement from you.
Quote
Most Christians don't read the bible literally. But for those that do, having non-believers hanging around your children can be a scary prospect. I am sure you get a long just fine with most Christians, it isn't them to whom I was referring. It is the one's you don't talk to, probably because the conversations are invariable uncomfortable. The ones to whom you felt it was wrong that they were raising their children this way.
Parents right to teach their religion to their children is protected by the constitution. To my way of thinking, if you outlaw the sincerely devout, you outlaw religion.
#47
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:26
I date a christian, my entire immediate family is christian, etc, I know their views and they know mine and we just don't talk about it anymore and in that way I am completely fine/tolerant/whatever.
#48
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:29
han, on 2012-December-20, 13:21, said:
Trinidad considers himself a tolerant non-believer. He thinks that telling another kid that he will go to hell because he doesn't believe in god is comparable to saying that you don't believe in god when asked about your religion. After all, both kids are just telling what they think, and it is shocking to the other kid. I don't agree with this, it is not the same.
So, when you teach your children that there is no hell (what you surely do, don't you?), why should your children be frightend if other kids else claims that their parents belive that in such a silliness? For your kids this should be just a kind of mistery novel, nothing real...
And if you follow your own logic, you better forbid your kids to talk about their "belives" too. It must be very frightening for theists kids to hear that there is no eternity.
But besides the logical flaw: I think it is very silly to try to talk about the hellfire with an innocent kid of an atheist.
Roland
Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
#49
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:32
dwar0123, on 2012-December-20, 17:23, said:
Not yet, but groups of atheists assaulting a church to dance naked on the pulpit has. Doesn't matter much, I don't know how I would react if able to punnish whoever destroyed a millenary buda in the name of some god either.
#50
Posted 2012-December-20, 17:37
Fluffy, on 2012-December-20, 17:32, said:
Are you referring to the pussy riot incident in Russia? Wasn't that politically motivated?
#51
Posted 2012-December-20, 18:37
Codo, on 2012-December-20, 17:29, said:
I wonder where folks get this idea of burning in hell anyway. Surely not from the Bible.
Making it up to scare the kids? Reading too much Milton?
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
#52
Posted 2012-December-20, 19:09
PassedOut, on 2012-December-20, 18:37, said:
Making it up to scare the kids? Reading too much Milton?
Or Dante.
I'm likely wrong, but I think his comments on people he did and didn't like in Italian society are largely influential of modern societal views on hell.
Never tell the same lie twice. - Elim Garek on the real moral of "The boy who cried wolf"
#53
Posted 2012-December-20, 19:24
BunnyGo, on 2012-December-20, 19:09, said:
I'm likely wrong, but I think his comments on people he did and didn't like in Italian society are largely influential of modern societal views on hell.
No doubt Dante played a big part in this too. I didn't realize that the writings of these men had become scripture and are still widely read by fundamentalist Christians.
The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists — that is why they invented hell. — Bertrand Russell
#54
Posted 2012-December-20, 21:30
#55
Posted 2012-December-20, 21:51
#56
Posted 2012-December-20, 22:19
Vampyr, on 2012-December-20, 21:30, said:
If the poll asked if you have an STD, would you say no if you had both gonorrhoea and herpes?
"...we live off being battle-scarred veterans who manage to hate our opponents slightly more than we hate each other.” -- Hamman, re: Wolff
#57
Posted 2012-December-20, 22:29
As for tv, screw it. You aren't missing anything. -- Ken Berg
I have come to realise it is futile to expect or hope a regular club game will be run in accordance with the laws. -- Jillybean
#58
Posted 2012-December-20, 22:38
wyman, on 2012-December-20, 22:19, said:
Naturally I would not, but it is the case that the majority of people who believe in gods believe in at most three.
#59
Posted 2012-December-20, 23:36
Vampyr, on 2012-December-20, 22:38, said:
All that despite the fact that the bible describes many gods--just one god you're supposed to worship.
Never tell the same lie twice. - Elim Garek on the real moral of "The boy who cried wolf"
#60
Posted 2012-December-21, 00:32
JLOGIC, on 2012-December-20, 17:26, said:
I date a christian, my entire immediate family is christian, etc, I know their views and they know mine and we just don't talk about it anymore and in that way I am completely fine/tolerant/whatever.
FWIW for the same reason I choose Tolerant, No strong feeling either way, and Infuriated. It all depends on the context and the people.